Andy Puddicombe & Rich Pierson of Headspace with Guy Raz | How I Built This | NPR

TL;DR

Meditation does not change what is happening around you, it changes your relationship to it. Headspace cofounder Andy Puddicombe explains that creating a small gap between a trigger, such as a news headline, and your reaction is the fundamental skill. Cofounder Rich Pierson adds that returning attention to the present moment lowers his anxiety and makes him easier to be around.

Transcript

hello everyone and welcome to how I built this resilience Edition how are you doing today I'm guy Roz and I am so excited about today's episode I want to remind you that we're taking your questions right now on Facebook on Twitter and on YouTube for Andy Puddicombe and rich Pierson the cofounders of headspace before we get started I just want to th... Read More

Key Insights

• Meditation only feels strange because the rest of modern life is built on distraction and overstimulation, according to Andy Puddicombe. Once you move past the discomfort of not doing anything, most people report a greater sense of calm and mental clarity.
• The core benefit of meditation is space, not fixing. Puddicombe frames it as the ability to notice something arising, internally as a thought or externally as a news headline, and then choose whether to engage with it rather than reacting immediately.
• Meditation does not change your external circumstances. Whether you are employed, recently laid off, in good health or poor health, the practice changes your relationship with those conditions so you can live more peacefully through the ups and downs.
• Anxiety registers physically before it registers mentally. Rich Pierson describes feeling churn in his chest when he is caught up in worry, and notices that in that state there is very little room left to actually interact with anyone around him.
• Resting in uncertainty is the specific thing people struggle with most, Pierson observes. His own practice is aimed at not over-planning the future and not worrying about what he imagines might happen, and instead returning to what he is doing right now.
• Andy's short practice follows a fixed sequence: soft open gaze, one deep breath in through the nose, eyes closing on the out-breath, body sinking into the seat, a body scan for heaviness or restlessness, then attention on the breath.
• If you cannot feel your breath during meditation, place a hand on your stomach and follow the rising and falling. Puddicombe offers this as the fallback when the sensation is not obvious in the chest or the stomach.
• Crisis drives people toward tools they think will help, Puddicombe notes, and Headspace saw a very large spike in both consumer sign-ups and inbound requests from organizations trying to figure out how to support teams shifting to remote work.

Questions & Answers

Q: How does meditation actually reduce anxiety?

According to Andy Puddicombe, meditation works by creating space between a stimulus and your reaction. When something arises, either internally as a thought or externally as a news headline, the untrained impulse is to react immediately. Practice builds the capacity to notice the thing, pause, and then decide whether you want to engage with it or let it go. He calls that extra space a fundamental skill for the mind and for life. Most people who get past the initial strangeness report a greater sense of calm, more clarity and less confusion, and less reactivity overall.

Q: Why does sitting still and meditating feel so weird at first?

Puddicombe argues it only feels weird by comparison. The rest of daily life is built on distraction and overstimulation, so the experience of not doing anything and simply being feels unnatural when you first sit down. That strangeness is a reflection of the baseline you are used to, not evidence that something is wrong with the practice. He says that once people get past that initial phase, the calm and clarity tend to follow, which is why the early sessions are worth pushing through rather than treating as a sign meditation is not for you.

Q: What is a simple two-minute meditation you can do right now?

Andy Puddicombe's short version, done live on the show, goes like this. Sit up or lie down. Start with the eyes open in a soft, unfocused gaze at the space in front of you. Take a big deep breath in through the nose, and as you breathe out through the mouth, gently close the eyes. Let the body sink down into the seat or floor beneath you. Take a moment to enjoy not doing anything. Check in with the body: restless or still, heavy or light. Then rest your attention on the breath for a few seconds. Finish by bringing attention back to the contact between you and the seat or floor.

Q: What should you do if you cannot feel your breath while meditating?

Puddicombe addresses this directly in the guided exercise. Some people feel the breath in the chest, others feel it in the stomach, and some cannot feel it at all. If you cannot feel anything, gently place your hand on your stomach and follow the rising and falling movement instead. The hand gives you a physical anchor when the internal sensation is not obvious. He also notes that thoughts will come up throughout, and the instruction is to allow those to come and allow them to go, then gently return the attention rather than fighting them.

Q: Can meditation fix the problems causing your stress?

No, and Puddicombe is explicit about this. He says people sometimes approach meditation thinking it will fix everything, but it will not change the circumstances around you. Whether you are in work or recently lost your job, whether you are in good health or experiencing poor health, the external facts stay the same. What changes is your relationship with those things. That shift is what allows you to live more peacefully through the ups and downs of a crisis. Framing meditation as a fix sets up disappointment; framing it as a change in relationship matches what the practice actually does.

Q: What does Rich Pierson say meditation has done for him personally?

Pierson says that without a doubt it has helped him, particularly with what he identifies as his own core struggle: resting in uncertainty and not knowing. His tendency is to plan too much for the future and worry about what he thinks might happen. When he remembers to bring his attention back to what he is doing right now, his anxiety and worry levels drop and, in his words, he is nicer to be around. He also describes the physical contrast: when he is caught in that anxious state he feels churn in his chest, and there is very little room to actually interact with anyone.

Q: How did the pandemic change demand for Headspace?

Puddicombe reports a very large spike in usage and sign-ups, especially in the early data at the beginning of the pandemic, along with a sharp rise in media searches related to anxiety and stress. Inbound interest from businesses and organizations also climbed steeply, with companies asking how to support their teams and help everyone transition to working from home. Headspace responded by making the app free for frontline health workers and for people who had lost their jobs, and by producing content specifically for people in New York and in Michigan.

Q: Who founded Headspace and how did they meet?

Headspace was cofounded by Andy Puddicombe and Rich Pierson. Puddicombe trained as a Buddhist monk, while Pierson was a burned out advertising executive going through a personal crisis. The two met in London more than a decade ago and eventually, in 2010, came up with what would become Headspace. Guy Raz notes that the full origin story was covered in an earlier How I Built This episode. Today the company is described as a media company as much as a technology company: it creates content including sleepcasts and has launched a podcast.

Summary

In this video, NPR's Guy Raz interviews Andy Puddicombe and Rich Pierson, the cofounders of the meditation app Headspace. They discuss the benefits of meditation, how it can reduce anxiety, and how it can provide a sense of calm and clarity in stressful times like these. They also talk about the spike in users during the pandemic and the free access they are providing to healthcare workers and people who have lost their jobs. The interview ends with the cofounders answering questions from viewers about meditation and offering tips on maintaining a consistent meditation practice.

Questions & Answers

Q: How does meditation help to reduce anxiety and stress?

Meditation provides a sense of calm and clarity to the mind, allowing us to have more space to observe our thoughts and emotions. By developing this awareness, we can choose how we want to engage with them and avoid reactiveness. While meditation doesn't solve all our problems, it changes our relationship with them and helps us navigate through difficult times with more peace of mind.

Q: Which meditation topics would be helpful for someone who just lost their job and is planning to switch careers?

For someone dealing with the anxiety and stress of losing a job and the uncertainty of starting a new career, the anxiety, change, and self-esteem meditation packs on the Headspace app can be beneficial. These topics can help individuals manage their anxiety, embrace change, and build confidence during this transition period.

Q: When is the best time of day to meditate?

While there is no definitive answer, many people find it helpful to meditate first thing in the morning. Doing it early ensures that it gets done and sets a positive tone for the rest of the day. It also helps to emphasize the importance of mindfulness throughout the day, rather than just during the meditation session itself.

Q: Does meditation help with frustration and the feeling of things being out of our control?

Yes, meditation can help with frustration and feelings of a lack of control. By cultivating mindfulness, we learn to accept our thoughts and emotions without judgment and observe them with curiosity. This allows us to let go of the need for control and find peace even in the face of uncertain circumstances.

Q: How can one stick with a consistent meditation practice?

To stick with a consistent meditation practice, it is essential to set clear intentions and establish a routine. Linking meditation to an existing habit or daily activity can help make it a natural part of one's day. Additionally, it is important not to be too hard on oneself for missing a day or two. Showing self-compassion and getting back on track when necessary is key to maintaining a consistent practice.

Q: In five years' time, what do the cofounders hope to learn from this moment?

The cofounders hope that, in the future, this moment will be seen as a turning point in how mental health is prioritized and discussed globally. They believe that this crisis has accelerated the conversation around mental health and its importance, and they hope that mental health will be integrated into schools, businesses, and communities. They also hope that people will reassess their priorities and focus on what truly matters in life, such as health and happiness.

Summary & Key Takeaways

• Guy Raz hosts Andy Puddicombe and Rich Pierson of Headspace for a live resilience episode of NPR's How I Built This, taking audience questions from Facebook, Twitter and YouTube. Both founders describe feeling privileged: they still have work, and their families and friends are well, while sharing the ordinary domestic stress of the moment.

• Andy leads a short guided meditation on the spot. He starts with the eyes softly open, takes a deep breath in through the nose, closes the eyes on the out-breath, lets the body sink into the seat, checks in with physical sensations, then rests attention on the rise and fall of the breath, letting thoughts come and go without chasing them.

• The founders discuss the business side. Andy reports a very large spike in app sign-ups and in inbound requests from companies asking how to support teams moving to remote work. Headspace made the app free for frontline health workers and people who lost their jobs, and created dedicated content for New York and Michigan.